My first spawn: Spike & Clover

Hi everyone.

I usually post on another forum so some of you will probably know me *poor you* but I thought I would write up on bettabred about my first spawn experience, and try and broaden my e-horizons :-) I'm very nervous and would be glad to share my latest news and get any advice from the experts who can advise how best to care for my little wrigglers! I'm already so protective over them, my other half feels jealous, LOL!

The parents are Spike, my DRCT and he is a pink/lavender/red marble, and Clover, a pale yellow DRCT girlie. The pre-spawn story is boring, I literally put Spike in the breeding tank Monday morning, where he began building a thick nest right away under the IAL. I added Clover to the tank that lunchtime in the breeding trap, and they showed some interest (mostly Spike) and nest building continued all day and night. The next day there was a good sized thick nest, and by lunchtime I noticed Clover wriggling for Spike and lowering her head. She was already gravid when I added her to the tank although she looked fatter, so I put her in with him. She swam right under the nest and he followed, he flared at her a few times then they started nudging sides, and started wrapping under 2 minutes from taking her out the trap..! It took them a couple of hours and when they lost interest in each other and Clover got chased away, I took her out. The eggs hatched late yesterday afternoon and continued through the evening until around 8pm when I saw the first fry fall from the nest.

Here are some pics of the parents, and a few rubbishy pics of the fry (my camera is useless and the water is quite stained from the IAL):

Spike:



Spike when he was younger but he's still this colour:



Clover:



Clover again:



A lone fry who decided to bouycot the IAL nest and have the bubblewrap to himself:



Fry falling from the nest:



Fry on the tank floor:



I have a couple of questions if anyone has any advice: There seemed to be loads of fry, loads tumbled down onto the floor and dad had a hard time keeping up. I woke in the middle of the night and checked them, and there seemed to be less fry so I worry dad might of eaten some, or maybe my eyes are playing tricks. He seems to have lost a bit of interest in the nest now, he keeps wandering off, although if he's around the nest and sees a fry fall out, he will usually put it back. There are a few on the floor too..can anyone tell me if they'll be OK on the tank floor? And would anyone adivse I take Spike out early as he seems to of lost a bit of interest? I keep worrying he's going to snap and munch them all, but I don't want to interfere unless it damages the fry!

Thanks for reading!

Jess :-)

Well kel always told me for every 1 you can see theres another 10 somewhere lol (something along those lines anyways).

If you think he has lost intrest and most of the fry are free swimming remove jess.

Hope that helps

Oh Im in love with Clover she is gorgeous

Good luck with those babies !

Hi jess im on my first spawn, my 2 spawned on tuesday and noticed the fry this morning, im on a bit of a learning curve with this one, good look with yours

Sarah

Thanks Storm, Spike has now decided he loves the babies again and has picked all the ones from the tank floor, bar a couple (assuming they're probably dead ones..:-( ), and is under the nest again. I'm keeping an eye on him, and will prob take him out tomorrow aslong as he stays in a stable mental condition lol. The fry are driving him bonkers, a couple of them have fallen right on top of his head and back, and he got annoyed because he couldnt get them off, LOL! The fry seem to be getting stronger, but none are swimming horizontally yet. Hopefully tomorrow!

Thanks magz, I hope I get some fry with Clover's lovely yellow colour and blue caudal rays! If I get a girl baby like her I'll have to let you know ^^

I actually read your breeding diary a few minutes ago Sarah, looks like both our pairs spawned roughly the same time on the same day! This is my first betta spawn too, I bred goldies a few years ago, but still feel like a total newb. It's really different - leaving the dad in to look after the eggs and babies is so nervewracking! I hope your fry do well, it'll be fun to see them all grow up at the same time together :-)

Hope he keeps it up but just in case and for future reference, if the male ignores the eggs and fry or starts eating them I remove him, lower the water level to an inch and a half or two and add methylene blue to keep them from getting fungus. Most times I get a good fry number from this method.

Its always good when you get 2 people that have had 2 spawns, that happened with me and nina and we kept talking to each other and getting ideas off each other.

Chard56 wrote: Hope he keeps it up but just in case and for future reference, if the male ignores the eggs and fry or starts eating them I remove him, lower the water level to an inch and a half or two and add methylene blue to keep them from getting fungus. Most times I get a good fry number from this method.

Thanks Chard, it's good to have a backup plan handy and know people have had success with it. Will the fry eventually pick themselves up off the floor and start free-swimming if the dad is taken out? I'm pretty sure that he's left a couple on the floor because they're dead :-S I'd hate to siphon them up and dispose of them when the time comes to do a tidy up, only for them to be alive. I'll probably put any water I siphon into a tub and then have a proper look through and check there's no wrigglers before I chuck the water out.

That's good to know Storm, us newbie breeders need to stick together and swap stories, I hope Sarah and I get a good haul! I have a couple of Nina's babies too from that spawn she did, some lovely girlies :-)

I got a male and female from her, they are loverly fish

I have took a break from spawning betta, moved back to basics guppy/mollies and swords they never let you down.

Think we need all the help we can get, dosnt matter how many times you googe the internet for info getting good advice from people with experience or someone going through the same is far better, last few days have been really stressful, im glad i havnt had much work on, feel much better been able to keep an eye on him,

Hows the babies this morning jess

Hope yours ok today mine are still here thank god, its a constant worry,

sarah

Fry left to themselves usually take a little longer to become actively freeswimming. Only by a half day or so. It's like the difference between hatching at 84 degrees and 76 degrees. At 84 they hatch in 36 to 40 hours and at 76 they take over 50 hours. If the male is mouthing them it seems to speed up the hatching. Without him in there taking care of them they don't get moved around and helped along in coming out of the shell I'm guessing. And as far as internet info you have to take it with a grain of salt and find good backup articles to lend credit to what you read. I read an article from a credited breeder that said if a female Betta was not spawned by the time she was 3 months old that she would then start exhibiting male characteristics so I tried to put my 3 month olds in with older males and lost 2 out of 3 (vital to my breeding program) to I'm assuming, heart attacks and the other to being aggressively beaten. This was years ago but I learned not to believe something just because they are supposedly an "expert or "professional".

Hi guys, I've been crazy busy today, had a rubbish morning so on a whim decided to take my youngest daughter to Pizza Hut for a late lunch, mmm.

When I got home this afternoon a couple of the babies were free swimming, and more were attempting too, but Spike seemed to be in a complete daze, and ignored them for the most part, and wandered off so I decided to take him out. Whilst trying to get him out, I accidentally bumped the IAL nest, and most of the babies fell out! It was a bit crazy, nearly all of them could swim or float horizontally, and quite a few swam off to explore. Alot of them swam back under the IAL nest though. I'm quite worried as their egg sacs are almost gone but I don't know how to feed them if they won't come out from under the IAL..I don't want them to starve! I've put a tiny bit of Atison's Betta Starter on the surface hoping they might eat, or forage on the floor when it sinks. Some of the babies are still on the floor, some cling to the tank walls and mossballs. Is any of this normal? No matter how much I read or watch online, it doesn't seem to make a difference now I actually have a spawn going! I completely understand your point Chard, you can only learn so much online before you have to decide what works for you. It's horrible you lost those females to that bad advice!

Pics taken just now:

aren't they sooo tiny

makes you wonder how they get so big in a couple of months, nevermind how any of them survive in the wild.

looking good!

Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

Thanks Kel! I can't stop worrying about them, I've just fed them a second time and swirled the food in the water instead of sprinking it on top, and that seems to have stirred more interest from them which is a relief, I'm pretty sure they were chasing bits of food and getting some. There seems to be loads of fry, can't wait til they're big enough to count!

I've never tried betta starter right from the word "go" as it looks bigger than the fish lol. I usually start with egg yolk for the first two weeks. You'll have to let me know (which you are doing) how it goes... (pointless statement really)

Hows the little ones jess

Hi Storm, thanks for asking. They all still seem to be here, whizzing around the tank and being extra curious about everything. They don't scare very easily - I put my hand in to siphon and add some mature live plants, and they were coming to have a nosey while I had my hand in there!

I don't know if they're eating the atison's starter food, some is still on the surface, some on the tank floor, but they do seem interested when I swirl it into the water. They may also be getting some infusoria from the live plants I've been adding from my healthy mature tanks: anubias, frogbit, bit of duckweed, and I've had mossballs in the breeding tank for weeks already. I think I'll try Kel's egg powder recipe tomorrow and see how they react to that. I worry about them so much, lol, it's so stressful and exciting, lol ;-)

LOL it is indeed, the egg mixture worked for me

at same time.. loads of plants also provide the natural food which is 10 X better but ehh works as long as you don't over do it

if you've lots of plants i'd do one-two sprays per feed .. just enough to spread it over whole tank

glad they're doing good though hun!

Hi ya glad they are doing ok, think mine are two, going to set up my brine shrimp hatchery today, mine arnt very timid they are quite nosey really, wish my worm cultures would grow quicker they are ideal for them they wriggle about in the water,

Thanks very much for the advice kel, you just made my day (even though I'm only JUST catching up with my online stuff! I worry so much about the fry not eating, but what you said about them getting natural food from the live plants has made me relax a bit. In their tank theres one small anubias plant that's got tons of leaves on it, four mossballs and about 7 pieces of frogbit. All those plants are matured so I hope you're right and they're giving natural food to the fry. The sponge filter is very mature and prob full of stuff growing on it (good stuff I hope!). I'll add some more matured plants tomorrow, but I gave the fry a feed of banana worm this evening and they seemed to enjoy it. Well most of them did - some haven't made a move to eat the worms and have smaller, paler bellies and hang around the cover of the plants/IAL. But some seem to hunt the worms and have bigger whiter bellies. I really hope the paler fry start looking for the worms too, I'd hate for them to get weak from huger or something and die :-S

Sarah - I thought the fry would be all scared and hide whenever something happened in the tank, but they come right up and swim about and see what's going on. Some even respond when I sit at the front of the tank and follow my finger around, it's fab. I took your success with the banana worms and tried them myself, my fry like them too! I think by the end of all our hard work we'll have to swap a few babies, seeing as they all have the same birthday, lol :-)

Glad everythings going well for you